Any opinions on this reel?

[george]

Granted it's expensive, but I'd still like to know your thoughts. West Coasties love' em. I've heard from a few people that they take some TLC a bit too often.

Accurate Valiant Fishing Reel

*Please Note: 300, 400N, 500N, 600NN no longer come with frame studs. Please note before ordering: The following models are built to order and can take up to 4-6 weeks before shipping. BV2-400L, BV2-500L, BV2-500NL, BV2-600L, BV2-600NL, BV2-600NNL, BV2-800L, BV2-800NL, BV2-1000L, BV-400L...

accuratefishing.com

 

[Snapprhead27]

I have a 300 I bought at the end of last year. I plan on using it for an ultra light tog setup. I'll snap some pictures at halftime. I tried it once for fluke but slow bite so I really couldn't test it out.

 

[Leprechaun]

I have a buddy with that reel, which he uses for togging. He likes it well enough. It probably should go back to the manufacturer annually for PM's.

 

[Snapprhead27]

 

[Roccus7]

It probably should go back to the manufacturer annually for PM's.

That immediately knocks it off a consideration list for me. An annual MFG PM is at least $100, so if you'd like to buy that reel and figure you'll get 10 seasons out of it, make sure that you tack that $1000 onto the reel's price. And don't forget when the MFG is so busy he can't get your reel back to you in time for the spring season.

I'd be asking my self is it worth that amount when you look at a similar reel that you can get parts for and service yourself.

One thing that often gets overlooked is the true purpose of a reel, which is a line storage device and something to smoothly pay out line when needed. It's not a winch! So line capacity and a smooth drag are the 2 most important part of the equation. Retrieve speed is a matter of personal preference, or necessity when it comes to hunting albies.

 

[OVERBORED]

I personally have no use for a lever drag reel ESPECIALLY black fishing.

West Coast guys love them because they do alot of live bait fishing and/or casting iron.

IMHO, there are much better choices for the fishing we do.

Try this reel:

Daiwa Bait Reel 19 Catalina (2019 Model) Amazon.com

Or one of these in a smaller size

Daiwa Saltiga SASD35HA Conv Star Drag Reel Amazon.com

 

[Leprechaun]

Though I do own four Avet lever-drag reels, I've never thought of them as legit blackfish reels. I do (did, actually) love them for live-lining bunker to big bass, as well as using my smaller SX and SXJ for diamond jigging.

My buddy Capt. Mike uses his to tog, and he really likes it, so there’s that.

However, though I consider myself fully competent to service most any reel, I DETEST working on Avets and pretty much every other LD reel, as I find that simple as they are, after a good cleaning and re-lube I can put them back together five times in a row and get five different free-spool and cranking outcomes. I hate working on them so much that they are the ONLY reels that I refuse to take in for servicing. Lever drag reels and I just don’t seem to see eye-to-eye.

I’ve never worked on an Accurate of any type, but if they are anything like the Avets, no freakin’ thanks. And now that I think about it, I believe those Valiant reels are called dual-drag, or something like that. This means two drag systems, one on either side of the spool. Absolutely, positively, no thank you.

Pretty they are, no doubt about it. And solid performers, so I’m told. Service them myself? Yeah, no thank you, sir!

 

[longcast]

I’ve had my accurate for two seasons now. Used it for blackfish but it really shined for live lining bass. They service for two years so this season I get one more service before I pay. Flat fee $50 after first two years. Absolutely love the reel.

 

[captmike28]

Though I do own four Avet lever-drag reels, I've never thought of them as legit blackfish reels. I do (did, actually) love them for live-lining bunker to big bass, as well as using my smaller SX and SXJ for diamond jigging.

My buddy Capt. Mike uses his to tog, and he really likes it, so there’s that.

However, though I consider myself fully competent to service most any reel, I DETEST working on Avets and every other LD reel, as I find that simple as they are, after a good cleaning and re-lube I can put them back together five times in a row and get five different free-spool and cranking outcomes. I hate working on them so much that they are the ONLY reels that I refuse to take in for servicing. Lever drag reels and I just don’t seem to see eye-to-eye.

I’ve never worked on an Accurate of any type, but if they are anything like the Avets, no freakin’ thanks. And now that I think about it, I believe those Valiant reels are called dual-drag, or something like that. This means two drag systems, one on either side of the spool. Absolutely, positively, no thank you.

Pretty they are, no doubt about it. And solid performers, so I’m told. Service them myself? Yeah, no thank you, sir!

I do use my Avet SX for primarily Blackfishing and some deep-water Sea Bass work. Although I like my Avet SX very much, as Lep had noted, it does require a lot more TLC than other brands. However, properly maintained I find the performance to be excellent.

Having said that they do seem a bit stressed when it comes to full time Tog fishing. Funny story about this. A few years ago, I noticed some grinding noises with the reel late in the season. I did a quick PM but that didn't solve the problem Called the Avet Service department in CA and the first question from the tech was "Do you use this reel for Blackfishing?"

It seems that the powerful runs of our local Tog do a job on the end cap bearings requiring more frequent replacement. I now try to change those about every 2-3 years and seem to have no other related problems.

 

[Leprechaun]

Mike, just to clarify, what the tech at AVET meant was that togging requires a fairly tight drag, and this crushes the spool bearing in the right side plate, thereby making that nasty grinding noise and destroying free spool.

Explanation: this is because the mechanics of how AVET constructs their "standard" reels is that the free spool lever utilizes a cammed eccentric to pull the spool (with its integral carbon drag washer) tight to the metal drag plate - the tighter the drag, the more the spool has to move to the right. This overloads the right side pinion bearing, effectively crushing it inside its side plate bearing cup.

This is how nearly all lower to mid-tier lever drag reels work - tighten the drag and the spool pulls tight to the right side plate. It's obvious when fishing a tight drag, as the handle cranking effort goes way up as the drag is increased past its designed maximum point.

The very best LD reels are built with a different type of pinion bearing in the right side plate - I think its called a conical bearing (or maybe annular? I forget), instead of a standard radial bearing, which is better suited to a star drag reel. This other type of upgraded pinion bearing is better designed to tolerate the heavy drag side pressure without deforming (crushing), or causing the retrieve to tighten up. I think AVET went in that direction with their upgraded "Raptor" series, but I'm not really sure.

Here's a vid of the (temporary) resolution of this issue. Click the "Watch on YouTube" hyperlink.



Not a fan of the tech's sparse use of reel lube inside the reel (especially his not putting a light wipe of grease on the new bearings' outer race surface - so to make it's inevitable next replacement less stressful), but otherwise, that's how it's done. Note the original pinion bearings' resistance to removal. This is super common, and yet another reason that I hate working on these reels. He said he had to use "another method" to remove that bearing, but didn't say what it was.

I do know that I've had to resort to putting the side plate in my bait freezer overnight, and then use a heat gun on the outside of the side plate to expand it slightly (thermal expansion, anyone?). This gives enough clearance to get the bearing out of its cup. Well, sometimes anyway. I forgot about this part of the AVET servicing nightmare. Thanks to the video's technician for reminding me about this part of the job. Ugggh.

What's the solution? Several really sharp machinists have attempted to bore the bearing's cup a bit larger, in order to accept the "better" annular bearing. This never really worked out, because the side plate's metal is so thin at that location that heavy drag pressure can push the bearing right through the side plate. Not good.

The correct remedy is to not fish these reels above their designed-in drag limit, which is spelled out pretty clearly in the owner's instructions that AVET now puts in their boxes. I believe for the little SX/SXJ that limit is around 9 pounds of drag. No one I know fishes for blackfish with '"just" 9 pounds of drag - hence this problem will always be an ongoing issue.

Or just go with a better designed reel. Maybe the little Accurates discussed above address this? I dunno, but the proof would be to tighten up the drag knob, then slide the drag lever forward, and see if the handle cranking effort increases. If not, this would be proof positive that Accurate's design is superior.

 

[Leprechaun]

You know, the guy to talk to about all of this is "Reel Designer Extraordinaire," Chris Martell, "Tunatoys" on various interweb post boards. He was and maybe still is a U.S. rep for Italy's Everol LD reels, and had a hand in refining several of their newer models. He was a both a site moderator and a regular poster on my old Noreast.com board, but has never put in an appearance here. A great loss, believe me.

He did take on my original AVET SX and worked his machinist magic on it, increasing its ability to fish at higher drag settings. I have no idea what he did, but I do know it involved machine work, some upgraded bearings and some kind of LD reel tuner freak'n witchcraft that is well beyond my skill level. If anyone still fishes with him, or knows his whereabouts, post it here, as his contributions on threads like this would be awesome. He is a great guy, for sure.

 

[captmike28]

Mike, just to clarify, what the tech at AVET meant was that togging requires a fairly tight drag, and this crushes the spool bearing in the right side plate, thereby making that nasty grinding noise and destroying free spool.

Explanation: this is because the mechanics of how AVET constructs their "standard" reels is that the free spool lever utilizes a cammed eccentric to pull the spool (with its integral carbon drag washer) tight to the metal drag plate - the tighter the drag, the more the spool has to move to the right. This overloads the right side pinion bearing, effectively crushing it inside its side plate bearing cup.

This is how nearly all lower to mid-tier lever drag reels work - tighten the drag and the spool pulls tight to the right side plate. It's obvious when fishing a tight drag, as the handle cranking effort goes way up as the drag is increased past its designed maximum point.

The very best LD reels are built with a different type of pinion bearing in the right side plate - I think its called a conical bearing (or maybe annular? I forget), instead of a standard radial bearing, which is better suited to a star drag reel. This other type of upgraded pinion bearing is better designed to tolerate the heavy drag side pressure without deforming (crushing), or causing the retrieve to tighten up. I think AVET went in that direction with their upgraded "Raptor" series, but I'm not really sure.

Here's a vid of the (temporary) resolution of this issue. Click the "Watch on YouTube" hyperlink.



Not a fan of the tech's sparse use of reel lube inside the reel (especially his not putting a light wipe of grease on the new bearings' outer race surface - so to make it's inevitable next replacement less stressful), but otherwise, that's how it's done. Note the original pinion bearings' resistance to removal. This is super common, and yet another reason that I hate working on these reels. He said he had to use "another method" to remove that bearing, but didn't say what it was.

I do know that I've had to resort to putting the side plate in my bait freezer overnight, and then use a heat gun on the outside of the side plate to expand it slightly (thermal expansion, anyone?). This gives enough clearance to get the bearing out of its cup. Well, sometimes anyway. I forgot about this part of the AVET servicing nightmare. Thanks to the video's technician for reminding me about this part of the job. Ugggh.

What's the solution? Several really sharp machinists have attempted to bore the bearing's cup a bit larger, in order to accept the "better" annular bearing. This never really worked out, because the side plate's metal is so thin at that location that heavy drag pressure can push the bearing right through the side plate. Not good.

The correct remedy is to not fish these reels above their designed-in drag limit, which is spelled out pretty clearly in the owner's instructions that AVET now puts in their boxes. I believe for the little SX/SXJ that limit is around 9 pounds of drag. No one I know fishes for blackfish with '"just" 9 pounds of drag - hence this problem will always be an ongoing issue.

Or just go with a better designed reel. Maybe the little Accurates discussed above address this? I dunno, but the proof would be to tighten up the drag knob, then slide the drag lever forward, and see if the handle cranking effort increases. If not, this would be proof positive that Accurate's design is superior.

Of course, Lep's description of the real problem was far more detailed and accurate compared to the simple version I related. It is certainly true that the 9# max drag rating on this reel forces one to "push the limits" when ti comes to Tog fishing.

So, the bottom line remains that if you want to use this reel for Tog then definitely expect to do more maintenance on it than a different design. I also agree that the bearing change can be a bit of a pain. In my experience having done this a few times now, the difficulty of removal depends, to a certain extent, upon how long you go between replacement intervals. If you really put the screws to the drag, then I'm sure that also makes removal at a later date even more challenging. No doubt the first time I attempted this after too many years of neglect, I needed to heat up the frame to get the old bearings out.

Another question does come to mind. Lep mentions using his Avet successfully for Big Bass and I would think you need just as much drag to slow down a fish of those proportions, just like a big Tog. What am I missing here?

 

[Leprechaun]

Another question does come to mind. Lep mentions using his Avet successfully for Big Bass and I would think you need just as much drag to slow down a fish of those proportions, just like a big Tog. What am I missing here?

Yes, we do like them for bigger bass when fishing live bunker here on the South Shore. You may not be real familiar with this type of fishing. Typically it's done along our sandy beaches in less than 40' of water, sometimes in less than 25'. There are no obstructions, nothing the bass can get to that might cut the line. This is the opposite of the rocky bottom that you East End guys fish in the various "between the islands" Guts and Sluices out there - and we certainly don't have to contend with ridiculously fast tidal currents.

So we let them run against the drag, a good bit anyway, so to tire themselves before the final gaff or net. Yes, I know it's all about the "slots" now. But this policy is very new, I'm talking prior to whenever that ruling took effect. I'm not really sure when that was, because I no longer do this kind of fishing.

Also, a more appropriate AVET reel for this would be the larger MX/MXJ, which have considerably higher drag capabilities. I still like/liked the little SX/SXJs for this, but it takes a bit more patience and skill to use the smaller reels for the large ladies. They work just fine though. Big bass are strong, true enough, but they certainly ain't BFT, that's for sure.

I would have loved to give the tiny Accurate lever-draggers discussed in this thread a try against these fish, but no such reel existed back when I did this fishing. The smallest LD reel available in those days was the AVET SXJ.

On my itty, bitty SXJ:

On my MXJ:

Drifting livies off Gilgo - note my homemade "Live Bunker Caddy" in the cockpit port corner. Back then the fish we caught required the big Igloo 162 on the swim platform. We weren't playing around. This fishing was serious bidness:

These readings gave us a very good day, off the Pt. Lookout "Mushrooms." Note the depth:

Can't argue with results like this:

"The proof is in the pudding"

 

[captmike28]

Yes, we do like them for bigger bass when fishing live bunker here on the South Shore. You may not be real familiar with this type of fishing. Typically it's done along the sandy beaches in less than 40' of water, sometimes in less than 25'. There are no obstructions, nothing the bass can get to that might cut the line. This is the opposite of the rocky bottom that you East End guys fish in the various "between the islands" Guts and Sluices out there - and we certainly don't have to contend with ridiculously fast tidal currents.

So we let them run against the drag, a good bit anyway, so to tire themselves before the final gaff or net. Yes, I know it's all about the "slots" now. But this policy is very new, I'm talking prior to whenever that ruling took effect. I'm not really sure when that was, because I no longer do this kind of fishing.

Also, a more appropriate AVET reel for this would be the larger MX/MXJ, which have considerably higher drag capabilities. I still like/liked the little SX/SXJs for this, but it takes a bit more patience and skill to use the smaller reels for the large ladies. They work just fine though. Big bass are strong, true enough, but they certainly ain't BFT, that's for sure.

I would have loved to give the tiny Accurate lever-draggers discussed in this thread a try against these fish, but no such reel existed back when I did this fishing. The smallest LD reel available in those days was the AVET SXJ.

On my itty, bitty SXJ:

View attachment 85110

On my MXJ:

View attachment 85111

Drifting livies off Gilgo - note my homemade "Live Bunker Caddy" in the cockpit port corner. Back then the fish we caught required the big Igloo 162 on the swim platform. We weren't playing around. This fishing was serious bidness:

View attachment 85112

These readings gave us a very good day, off the Pt. Lookout "Mushrooms." Note the depth:

View attachment 85113

Can't argue with results like this:

View attachment 85114

"The proof is in the pudding"

View attachment 85115

It is true I have only Bass fished on the South Shore a handful of times in my life and forgot about the very "forgiving" conditions that allow for fishing with a much lighter drag, Makes perfect sense for your backyard. BTW, I do also own an MX Avet that I occasionally use in both the Gut and the Race. Definitely a more robust drag system on that model.


Some really nice Cows and a very "buff looking" Lep!!

 

[george]

@Leprechaun I almost didn't recognize you without a big fluke in your hand!

 

[OVERBORED]

Great photos!

My friends and I used to joke about taking pictures. Saying that someday we need to be reminded of how good we had it.

Now I look at them and am reminded of all the great people I fished with (as well as the d'bags) and the ones who are gone.

I was very lucky to have known and fished with some of the best!

Sorry....... hijacking again......lol

 

[Leprechaun]

Here's a vid from back when I took this fishing seriously:

 

[george]

That was great Pete! That voice on the video sounds familiar? Anyhow, when was that and how big was the video camera?

 

[george]

Great photos!

My friends and I used to joke about taking pictures. Saying that someday we need to be reminded of how good we had it.

Now I look at them and am reminded of all the great people I fished with (as well as the d'bags) and the ones who are gone.

I was very lucky to have known and fished with some of the best!

Sorry....... hijacking again......lol

I feel the same way. Last month, a friend dropped off some old Nor'east Saltwater magazines, and I came across so many photos that reminded me of how fortunate we were to have lived through those moments.

 

[Leprechaun]

That was great Pete! That voice on the video sounds familiar? Anyhow, when was that and how big was the video camera?

George, I'm not exactly sure how long ago that was, but rest assured it was a while ago. That "Topline Tools" sweatshirt I'm wearing in the movie looks fairly new, but was turned into a boat polishing rag between then and now - and I hate giving up my broken-in fishing sweatshirts - so it had to be a ways back.

I'm pretty sure that Robbie was using his cell phone for that movie, though I do recall him bringing a full DSLR on some of our trips. So, maybe that.

Did you happen to notice the embroidered name on the hat I'm wearing? Maybe look again. I'm always down with the struggle. A man's gotta represent!