Say Good Bye To Catch and Release Striped Bass Fishing

[george]

ASMFC's Focus on Catch-and-Release Mortality – What's Really Going On?​

Hey anglers, I have been warning about this day for a while now. We are on the cusp of losing the only fish we have in the spring. And all because we release them. If we don't send a unified word that they need to stop focusing on us now, we're in for trouble. This is what's being said about the recent ASMFC meeting.

The ASMFC’s recent focus on managing mortality from catch-and-release fishing, also known as dead discards. For years, we’ve all been practicing catch and release as a way to conserve fish populations, but now it feels like the narrative is shifting. They’re saying that catch and release is causing a significant number of fish to die, but where’s the solid, recent research backing this up? I haven’t seen any!

Think about how much things have changed over the years. We’ve all become more responsible as anglers, with better ethics and more restrictive tackle and techniques. Yet, they’re claiming that over 3 million striped bass are dying annually up and down the coast from catch and release. Have any of you seen this many fish floating or washed up on shore? It doesn’t add up.

Our sportfishing industry depends on catch and release, and if the ASMFC keeps pushing this narrative, it could seriously hurt us. We’ve already made so many sacrifices as a community, and it’s frustrating to see this kind of focus on us again.

What we need is more relevant research. The ASMFC should be testing mortality rates using the latest tackle and techniques, and they should do it in different seasons, considering current water temperatures and bait conditions. And let’s not forget the impact of circle hooks – they’ve been shown to reduce mortality by up to 50% compared to traditional J-hooks. We need to get an accurate estimate of how much circle hooks are actually helping.

Before any more restrictions are put on us, we need to make sure the data is accurate and up to date. What are your thoughts on this?

 

[WhatKnot]

I’m confused, as usual, would this not result in a ban on Striped Bass fishing? Or am I missing something. Are they considering delaying the opening of the Season because the Bass are smaller in the early spring and thus more Catch and Release.

 

[OVERBORED]

---

If true, regulators have themselves to blame. By making a ridiculous slot of 28-32", they have single handedly increased release rates thus increasing mortality.
Everyone who complied with these assinine rules are now going to be punished for it!

 

[Snapprhead27]

Was only a matter of time!

 

[george]

---

If true, regulators have themselves to blame. By making a ridiculous slot of 28-32", they have single handedly increased release rates thus increasing mortality.
Everyone who complied with these assinine rules are now going to be punished for it!

The meetings last week made it clear that this proposal was at the forefront of everyone's minds, and frankly, it's infuriating. Think about what they're doing. They slapped us with a 14% reduction, but then decided that was too much pressure on the commercial sector, so they only knocked them down by 7%. It's obvious they're not going to make any real cuts there, so we're the ones getting squeezed. And now they're pushing this absurd narrative that we're killing 3 million bass through catch and release. Does anyone seriously buy that number? It's a blatant exaggeration, and it's being used to justify even more restrictions on recreational anglers while the commercial sector gets a pass. This proposal is a slap in the face to everyone who loves this sport.

 

[CELLFISH]

American Littoral Society: should be banned from tagging local fish…

they aren’t aware they are killing a lot of fish, it’s nothing but a game… cell…

 

[Roccus7]

The meetings last week made it clear that this proposal was at the forefront of everyone's minds, and frankly, it's infuriating. Think about what they're doing. They slapped us with a 14% reduction, but then decided that was too much pressure on the commercial sector, so they only knocked them down by 7%. It's obvious they're not going to make any real cuts there, so we're the ones getting squeezed. And now they're pushing this absurd narrative that we're killing 3 million bass through catch and release. Does anyone seriously buy that number? It's a blatant exaggeration, and it's being used to justify even more restrictions on recreational anglers while the commercial sector gets a pass. This proposal is a slap in the face to everyone who loves this sport.

Yes, No Targeting Striped Bass was the elephant in the room last week. However before they resort to that, it was acknowledged that No Harvest Closures, was presented as a last ditch effort, may be needed. However it was stated by a CT board member that C&R fishing should still be allowed during No Harvest Closures.

While No Harvesting Closures may rear its ugly head, No State will agree to No Targeting closures.

• The Conservation Enforcement Reps on the Technical Committee continue to say it's absolutely unenforceable
• Many charter operations, especially the fly fishing ones, are already strictly C&R so this would shut them down, and like it or not, they are far more organized than recreational fishermen

 

[BoatGuy]

I’m sorry. Not sure how to address this post in reply mode. So I’ll do it in word. My relies/questions in Italic.

You said: If we don't send a unified word that they need to stop focusing on us now, we're in for trouble. This is what's being said about the recent ASMFC meeting.

I have never seen recreational fisherman show up in any great numbers at these meeting. What I do realize is you have to make it easier for us. We should meet at a certain area near where the meeting will be. We can go together and discuss the topic. Strength in numbers and comradery. Having done this, I will say commercials are well represented and vocal, as are the bait and tackle shops, party boat Captains, charter boat Captains and all others in the “industry”. Their livelihoods rely on it. I will say this, I have been to a few. It is probably me, but I feel out of place.

On that other old site. I went with Paul Risi, Hunt and Fish and “Crabby”. That’s all that showed when this was proposed.



Think about how much things have changed over the years. We’ve all become more responsible as anglers, with better ethics and more restrictive tackle and techniques.

For the knowledgeable fisherman like those on this site, I would agree. The average guy fishing Like those on the docks IMHO do not know the regulations. I’ll leave it at that.

Before any more restrictions are put on us, we need to make sure the data is accurate and up to date. What are your thoughts on this?

I want to share something. I was drifting for fluke. A dragger was heading in and for some reason stopped near me as he continued to head in. All of a sudden, fish start floating by me. Striped Bass, Black Sea Bass, etc. I am sure all the fluke sunk to the bottom. I assume the boat was over their limit and was dumping excess catch. I asked a knowledgeable fisherman in the industry about this. Usually his answers to my questions are quite detailed. His reply to the this was “ITS COMPLICATED”

The ASMFC’s recent focus on managing mortality from catch-and-release fishing, also known as dead discards. For years, we’ve all been practicing catch and release as a way to conserve fish populations, but now it feels like the narrative is shifting. They’re saying that catch and release is causing a significant number of fish to die, but where’s the solid, recent research backing this up? I haven’t seen any!

I agree. No data. And I must admit, I’m not sure how to get good data. I have often wondered about this. Let’s say I catch a 15 inch fluke. I quickly and as carefully as possible release it. How in the world does anyone know if it survives?


At the last Ward Melville, Mike “Salty” Fogg spoke on the importance of catch and release. He mentioned that sometimes it took 30 minutes to revive a Striped bass after release.

I have mentioned this to a Charter Captain I spoke to and his reply was “Between five percent and fifteen percent. Most fisheries use a number around ten percent. Again, here education goes a long way. People who dig for their hooks on fluke when the eye of the book is inside the mouth, or hold fish by the gills, or even worse inside the gills, can see it close to twenty percent.” I wanted to ask him where the data was, but never followed up.

Fish react to scores of conditions, many of which we have no idea about, and most of which we cannot measure or quantify to my knowledge. Sea surface temperature, the presence, concentration and movement of forage species, Plankton changes that extremely important to the forage species, Turbidity, Major storms. Loss of/change of habitat and pollutants to leach from cesspools up island into our estuaries. There are all kinds of studies and observations that need to be pieced together for the larger view.

Question: which groups still exist and can they help: I’m thinking RFA, IGFA and NYSF. Which are recreational fisherman friendly? Are there new groups?

 

[george]

@Roccus7 My good friend, please look at this for what it is. Do you think you're killing 10% of the bass you're releasing?

As an avid recreational angler, I’ve seen firsthand how many fisheries regulations are nearly impossible to enforce. Take the rule against culling, for example—how are they really monitoring that? Or the requirement to use circle hooks; who’s out there ensuring compliance? Then there’s the regulation that says you can’t use fluke strips for bait unless you caught them on the same trip. Good luck trying to enforce that one!

The truth is, most anglers I know respect the resource and the law, following these regulations voluntarily. Sure, they might catch an occasional rule-breaker, but enforcement isn’t what keeps the majority of us in line.

I’m also concerned about the potential for "No Harvesting" closures. While I believe no state will agree to "No Targeting" closures, there’s talk that the Atlantic States Marine Fisheries Commission (ASMFC) might push for regulations that stop us from fishing after we’ve caught a keeper. This has been brewing for years, based on questionable data.

We need to advocate for new studies, like the ones currently happening in Massachusetts, that examine fish populations both in and out of the bays and across all seasons. Research shows that circle hooks can reduce mortality rates by as much as 70%, yet this crucial information isn’t being considered in the current regulations. It’s not like they don’t know we’re using them!

Additionally, many charter operations, especially those focused on fly fishing, already practice strict catch-and-release. If new regulations come down the pipeline, it could really hurt these businesses. While they may be more organized than recreational fishermen, their numbers are small, and their influence here in New York is limited. I know many of these operators personally, and I can assure you they don’t have the clout to sway decisions in our favor.

As anglers, we must unite and advocate for regulations that are fair, practical, and based on solid science. Together, we can ensure the sustainability of our beloved fishing resources while protecting our rights as recreational anglers.

 

[BoatGuy]

@Roccus7

As anglers, we must unite and advocate for regulations that are fair, practical, and based on solid science. Together, we can ensure the sustainability of our beloved fishing resources while protecting our rights as recreational anglers.

How do we do that?

 

[Roccus7]

@Roccus7 My good friend, please look at this for what it is. Do you think you're killing 10% of the bass you're releasing?

I, like everyone else, don't know how many fish I've released eventually die, do you?

Like it or not, the only peer-reviewed study on release mortality was that 10% number, and like I've mentioned multiple times the new study is bearing that out. It covers all sorts of fishing and use, fly fishing has the lowest mortality rate going up to bait fishing which is the highest. They've also bracketed things like water temperatures, salinity concentrations, hook types, air temperatures, etc. ALL of these variables need to be examined and applied to get a coast-wide, recreational fishing mortality percentage. Regardless, if you think about it, even if it's really 5%, that number is still a huge one.

I've been fortunate this year all my fish swam away, without any instant "floaters", but I'd say about 3% of the ones released weren't in the best of shape, but I'll never know if they made it or not. I'll bet some of the ones that weren't 100% upon release became seal breakfasts, as they will often prowl close to me. Just another thing I'll never know.

That being said I do my best to ensure they get treated with TLC to help ensure they'll make it to the fall's migration south.

The biggest mumbo jumbo number in striped bass management is the estimation of how many are caught in a given year. If this is significantly overstated, then we're paying a penalty. I would submit that the most important "improvement" in striped bass management would be working on that number. The latest BS regarding the MRIP improvements give me absolutely no confidence that that endeavor will significantly improve MRIP data.

I think that most of us right now are losing the forest for the trees. Yes, the overall population of bass is nowhere near as bad as it was during the 80s crash, BUT the population distribution is horrible and that has been recognized by the regulators.

FACT: The Chesapeake, which provides 70-80% of the northeast's striped bass, has had a string of poor
spawns, and although NY has been running pretty well, 2023 wasn't a very good year for
spawning either.

Don't believe the data coming out of MD, VA, and NY? Consider my data which is very well-controlled, and has shown less and less small fish being caught over the years, with mean size on the yearly cohort, creeping up to 26" over the past 5 years from a steady 19-20" from 2013-2019. I've caught fish as small as 8" in previous years, this year I've only caught two, 22" fish and nothing smaller!! If this doesn't drive home the point that there is a huge "hole" in the bass population, I don't know.

There are many variables regarding spawn success as we all know, but only ones that fishery managers can control is taking steps that the Spawning Biomass is maximized, the root of the slots and 1 fish per day.

The old slot of 28-35" was simple, to keep more of the big, more fecund large breeders on the spawning grounds year after year. So yeah, it grieves me too, but there will never be my number 1 bucket list item since I was 13 years old, a 50+ lb hanging over the fireplace. At this point anything being done to ensure I'll actually be catching stripers until I die is more welcome than checking off the Bucket List item.

The "emergency" reduction of 28-31" was to protect the last outstanding MD spawn year which took place in 2015. Since virtually all the fish in the 28-35" slot would be from that 2015 year class, and they make up a significant percentage of the current breeding stock, ASMFC adjusted the slot so at least 1/2 of them would have grown out of the slot back in 2023 when it was enacted as an emergency measure. This is just simple common sense.

Don't like that slot? Well brace yourself, as the 2018 class, a reasonably good spawn in the Chesapeake will enter into the 28-31 slot in 2025. Now that the 2015 class has exited the slot, ASFMC has started considering slot adjustments to protect the class of 2018.

OK, I've gone on more than enough. The point I'm trying to make is that we do have a big problem with striped bass, and that is totally related to the epic fail of spawning in the Chesapeake for the past 5 years and I challenge ANYONE HERE to present data, not feelings, not stories from your brother in law's third cousin, etc. that refutes that fact. Most of the gyrations we're going through with regulations are to ensure that a healthy number of the 2015, and coming soon to a theater near you, the 2018 year class bass get to spawn more than one or two times.

What to do?

• Make sure you attend any of your State's meetings held by ASMFC regarding striped bass. By the time the meeting is held by the ASMFC Council it's a done deal.
  
  
• Keep good records. They help you understand where some of the regs come from. If your HARD DATA vary significantly from what the regulators are saying, bring that with you to your State's meetings to show instead of standing up and waving your arms while jabbering away about how they don't know what they're talking about. Believe me, IF ASMFC shows any data showing big numbers of 2024 recreational catches in Maine, I'll break out my records for the past few years and prove to them they're full of shit!!

 

[OVERBORED]

Every meeting I ever went to (I went to many in the 90s), I left feeling as if my opinion didn't matter and whatever council was in attendance that night had already made up their mind. The meetings always felt like a formality even when several captains in the business showed their catch data and made suggestions. Suggestions were never taken seriously.

IMHO, fisheries management is political like everything else. Commercial fishermen have a say because they hire lobbyists. If we want to be heard, we need to join the party and get the backing of a politician with some clout.

Zeldin heard us. We need someone else to hear us.

Statistics and research don't matter anymore.

 

[george]

Question: which groups still exist and can they help: I’m thinking RFA, IGFA and NYSF. Which are recreational fisherman friendly? Are there new groups?

As an angler deeply invested in the future of recreational fishing, I see a pressing issue that needs addressing. Today, it seems like everyone believes they're making a difference by voicing their opinions on social media platforms like Facebook. However, what we truly need is to unify all these voices—every single one of them. This includes influential publications like "The Fisherman" and "On the Water." Unfortunately, achieving this unity is challenging because these outlets often try to please everyone, which dilutes their impact.

When it comes to organizations, I know many of the key figures involved in protecting our fishing rights. Sadly, they often seem to be speaking only for themselves, driven by personal beliefs and perspectives. They don't genuinely represent the average angler's needs and desires. Instead, decisions are made based on what's best from their viewpoint, not ours.

Despite the uncertainties, we are planning a significant announcement in the coming months to attempt to bring about change and organize our community once again. It's a daunting task, perhaps the last major challenge I'm willing to take on, but it's necessary. If we don't act, we risk losing our beloved sport altogether.

Intentional or not, we're being regulated out of our sport, which is increasingly becoming elitist, catering to a small fraction of anglers. Consider this: in 2014, an 18-foot Roballo cost around $28,000; today, that same boat is over $58,000. The barriers to entry are much higher now than they were just a decade ago. Combine this with regulations that shut us down during peak seasons, and the future of fishing looks bleak. We must act to preserve the accessibility and joy of fishing for all.

 

[george]

Like it or not, the only peer-reviewed study on release mortality was that 10% number, and like I've mentioned multiple times the new study is bearing that out.

Have you come across the 96 studies? I'm currently working on a piece about it, and I hope you'll take a look at the facts. Did you know the study was conducted in a saltwater pond in Maryland, where the deepest point was only 3 meters? It took place in June and July, with water temperatures reaching 80 degrees. Are you okay with the fact that these fish were corralled in nets and after being put in the pond, they were targeted again? And then released again into an 80% pond with no option to look for cooler waters.

I'm honestly surprised they survived at all. Were they even feeding the fish in the pond? Can you imagine the stress they must have been under, trying to adapt to what was essentially a fish tank?

It's frustrating to think that millions of anglers along the coast are doing everything we can to conserve this species, only to have our regulators setting us up for failure.

I see this as a scandal of massive proportions. If we don't change course soon, we may not be fishing for bass in the spring—and it will all have been for nothing.

The new studies do not support that. They have shown that gut—and gill-hooked fish caused 70% of the mortality. There are no gill—or gut-hooked bass with circle hooks.

Regardless, if you think about it, even if it's really 5%, that number is still a huge one.

Yes It's a huge savings - 1.5 million fish. The only way you will get it under 5% is to stop us from fishing. And I know you don't want to do that

You

 

[george]

I've gone on more than enough. The point I'm trying to make is that we do have a big problem with striped bass, and that is totally related to the epic fail of spawning in the Chesapeake for the past 5 years and I challenge ANYONE HERE to present data, not feelings, not stories from your brother in law's third cousin, etc. that refutes that fact. Most of the gyrations we're going through with regulations are to ensure that a healthy number of the 2015, and coming soon to a theater near you, the 2018 year class bass get to spawn more than one or two times.

As the waters warm, things change, and that's what we're seeing in the Chesapeake. There may be fewer Striped Bass there now, but there are now Tarpon, and let's not forget that the voracious blue catfish has invaded the bay. These are not feelings, my good friend; they are true facts facing these issues that no one will even acknowledge. Here's some info on the blue catfish and their effect on YOY.

Blue catfish, an invasive species in the Chesapeake Bay, impact the striped bass population, particularly their spawning success. Blue catfish are known to be voracious predators, consuming a wide variety of aquatic life, including young striped bass. They have become the dominant fish-eating predator in the Bay's tributaries, where they often share nursery habitats with young striped bass. This overlap increases the likelihood of predation on juvenile striped bass, potentially reducing their numbers before they can mature and contribute to the population.

Why are we ignoring these issues? Does it seem coincidental that the increase in this invasive species happens at the same exact time as the base stock collapse?

The striped bass fishery in New York is thriving. Just look around, and you will see pictures of the healthiest-looking stripers I've ever seen. And it's everywhere. Big bass, little bass, and slot bass. Our anglers are enjoying some of the best bass fishing I've seen in my lifetime.

I don't feel that way. It's not my sister's brother-in-law telling me about it; thousands of anglers around coastal Long Island document it every day.

 

[OVERBORED]

I agree George.

Global warming and invasive species are a part of the problem. What happened to our lobsters here on LI is a cautionary tale of what happens when the waters warm.

Fishing changes season to season. Regulations need to be PROACTIVE and not REACTIVE as they have always been. The model needs an overhaul.

As fish populations decrease, all of these factors loom larger and cannot be ignored.

 

[Roccus7]

let's not forget that the voracious blue catfish has invaded the bay

No denying that, it's certainly important, but at this time it's one of the items that Striped Bass Regulators can't control. The also can't control the weather, so they're stuck with trying to get as many breeders as possible on the breeding ground come spring.

Just look around, and you will see pictures of the healthiest-looking stripers I've ever seen. And it's everywhere. Big bass, little bass, and slot bass.

Don't shoot the messenger here George, but the above statement IS hand waving. Without data, It does nothing to demonstrate that the population of stripers caught in NY comprises a healthy size distribution of fish, especially for fish under 20". What percentage of the fish are <12", 12-16", 16-20", 20-22", 23-25", 25-27", slot fish, 32-25", 35-40", >40"? That's what fishery managers need to know.

In one of your earlier posts you poo-pooed the YOY study when in fact it's is one of the most reliable data sets that regulators have for striped bass; it's light years ahead in reliability compared to MRIP. The YOY data, along with the stock assessment have been the drivers for the most recent set of regulations. All's I'm saying is that I have hard data that shows the impact of failed spans in the Chesapeake is being felt all the way up to Maine, and sources on LI's North Fork have echoed the observation of very few small fish being caught. This is the crux of the problem we're facing in the future. Yes the biomass overall is good, far better than the 80s crash, but it's skewed to bigger fish and that could become problematic in the future.

ASFMC has committed with Amendment 7 to have the population rebuilt by 2029. They will have a new stock assessment and this year's YOY data in place for the pivotal October meeting. If these studies suggest the planned stock rebuilding may not occur by the 2029 deadline, more Draconian measures will need to be taken, IF the political and economic pressure groups don't have sway.

 

[OVERBORED]

The economic impacts of any kind of closure will be devastating.

I won't even mention how much more pressure there will be on other species but that is a consequence that never seems to factor in.

 

[george]

@Roccus7 This is like the old days

Don't shoot the messenger here George, but the above statement IS hand waving. Without data, It does nothing to demonstrate that the population of stripers caught in NY comprises a healthy size distribution of fish, especially for fish under 20". What percentage of the fish are <12", 12-16", 16-20", 20-22", 23-25", 25-27", slot fish, 32-25", 35-40", >40"? That's what fishery managers need to know.

I'm going to believe what I see with my very eyes. I have been reporting on striped bass in New York for over 35 years, and what I've seen, heard, and witnessed has been a vibrant fishery. They are big fat, healthy, and strong. They're taking bunker on the pods and poppers in the bay.

I can't imagine what the fall will bring. By the way, you can catch all 10-16-inch fish you want, literally one after the other, in the usual suspect places.

That's what I see and what I hear. I respect your belief and trust in the data, but as a computer geek, I see it as garbage in and garbage out. MA is conducting some real studies now. Instead of haul-seining bass, releasing them into a pond in the middle of the summer, and then fishing for them again. They are catching and releasing striped bass in the wild, with a sat tag showing whether they lived or died. Now, that's a study I can get behind.

 

[george]

Here’s the real story on how the Catch and Release (C&R) testing was conducted. First off, let’s set the record straight—it wasn’t in ’96; the actual tests took place in 1989. I’ve pulled these facts straight from the study, which I’ve attached for your review.

Here’s how it went down: the fish were caught using haul seines and then tossed into a truck for a grueling 5-hour ride. After that, they were crammed into a smaller tank for a bit before being tagged and released into a 5,000-acre pond in Massachusetts. This pond, averaging just 4 feet deep and sitting at around 80 degrees, was hardly ideal. After feeding them for a while, they were targeted again—this time using traditional fishing techniques from the late '80s.

Honestly, I’m surprised any of those fish survived at all. Think about it—they were taken from the ocean, thrown into a truck for five hours, transferred to another tank, and then released into completely unfamiliar waters. And this is the study that’s being used to justify keeping us tied to the docks, imposing draconian measures that threaten our fishing future. We’re talking about a fishery that supports 10 million angler trips, all of whom deserve better.

We can’t just sit back and let this destroy our enjoyment and livelihoods.

Heres a recap

Location and Environment

• The study was carried out in a 2-hectare saltwater pond at the Massachusetts Division of Marine Fisheries Cat Cove Marine Laboratory in Salem, Massachusetts. The pond is a dammed inlet with an average depth of approximately 3 meters, reaching a maximum depth of 4.5 meters. It is not subject to tidal fluctuations but can be partially drained via sluice gates.
• Environmental conditions during the study included stable salinity (31 ppt) and pH (7.0), with surface water temperatures ranging from 15 to 28°C and bottom temperatures never exceeding 25°C. Dissolved oxygen levels varied from 6.0 to 9.0 mL/L at the surface and 3.8 to 8.4 mL/L at the bottom.

Fish Acquisition and Acclimation

• Striped bass were sourced from a trap-net operator in Newport, Rhode Island. Three fish traps were set within 3 km of shore and tended daily over a 20-day period. The fish were transported in a 760-liter holding tank with running seawater and tagged with uniquely coded Floy internal anchor tags during the trip to shore.
• The fish were then transferred to a 1,900-liter circular tank on a truck for delivery to the study site, with transfer time averaging 5 hours. Five batches of approximately 200 fish each were delivered between April 22 and April 28, 1989, with an additional delivery of 17 fish on June 13, bringing the total to 1,015 tagged fish released into the pond.
• To estimate mortality from tagging and transport, the first and last batches of fish were held in a net-pen in the pond for 24 hours and 5 days, respectively, before being released into the pond. The net-pen was 3 meters long, 5 meters wide, and 2 meters deep, constructed of 2.5-cm mesh nylon netting.
• The fish were given a 50-day acclimation period in the pond before the hooking experiment began, allowing them to adjust to the environment.

Feeding and Health Monitoring

• Indigenous populations of finfish and invertebrates in the pond, such as fourspine stickleback, Atlantic silverside, mummichog, mysid shrimp, and sand shrimp, provided a natural food source for the striped bass.
• Control fish were captured from the pond using gill-nets and held in a net-pen, where they were fed dead American sand lances and monitored for mortality throughout the study period.